Paul Daugherty: Fans take it in the neck, again

Wednesday, November 28, 2007

Fans take it in the neck, again

It is your fault, UC football fan, that the Bearcats aren't going to the almighty Muffler Bowl in Charlotte, NC, a freeway with a city in the middle of it. If you had been more willing to go to the Fort Worth Bowl -- and really, who doesnt dream of Fort Worth in December? -- maybe the Muffler people would have given your team the coveted Muffler bid.

If you had schlepped in droves to Detroit -- twice! -- to watch the legendary Motor City Bowl, your Bearcats would be going to Charlotte. Nothing quite says bowl pageantry and excitement like Detroit on Dec. 27.

And, of course, if you hadn't been so stupid last year, and somehow forsaken the one and only International Bowl in Toronto -- aka Football Heaven -- your scrappy little men would be dreaming Charlotte dreams today.

In other words, you are bad fans. Or at least, you aren't good enough, in the eyes of the Muffler dudes and the gods who run the Sun Bowl. El Paso: Why?

This line of thought extends to the UC athletic dept, where one Mike Waddell is now urging you to be "good fans'' by driving 420-some miles to Birmingham, garden spot of the universe, three days before Christmas. If you don't, you are responsible for UC not getting better bowl bids.

Personally, I think you're smart and discriminating and show some common sense.

Just my opinion.

37 Comments:

at 5:24 PM

Anonymous said...

Daugh, you're just being argumentative. I know that secretly you dream of being in Birmingham at Christmastime.

I think of all those classic Birmingham Carols and it absolutely humbles me.

at 9:27 PM

Anonymous said...

I don't get it. So is Mike Brown smart, and discriminating, and showing common sense in the way he's running the Bengals? Probably, yes he is; but we're ticked off at him for not giving the Bengals better.
Being a fan doesn't always make sense. To the contrary, it usually is anything but sensical.
If you love your team and love being around others who love your team it is worth it to load up your car and hit the road. Brian Kelly will not make his decision to stay or go based on what the stands look like in Birmingham, but it will be a reflection on the job and be something for people to take note of. Do you think people didn't notice when UK sold 45,000 tickets for the Music City Bowl last year? I guess thats sooo different since Nashville looks like its right out of a Norman Rockwell painting in late December, right? It feels like something big is building in Clifton, so why not show your support by being there? And who knows where that could lead to next year.

at 9:41 PM

Anonymous said...

It has helped that UC is suddenly interesting and fun, but it's more than that.
- Paul Daugherty 11/28

Don't tell longtime fans of UC football how to react to the bad bowl news 2 days after a comment like that. Now that we throw passes and score alot of points, it is ok to comment on the bowl process and have an opinion?

The Big East has WEAK bowl ties. We just need to travel and support the seniors that took this program to the next level. 10 wins is that next level.

You are missing the point. Fans should not make this trip for the administration or the bowl committees. They need to make this trip for the players and coaches.

at 10:03 PM

Anonymous said...

If Waddell weren't trying to sell fans on buying bowl tickets, I'd have a real problem. Doc, you really think he's wrong? The folks in the athletic dept. are probably the most disappointed in this, and they don't even get to complain.

And I think Waddell is just tellin it like it is, even if we don't like to hear it. I don't call that blaming the fans, I call it giving them the information. We can't handle the truth!

at 10:28 PM

Anonymous said...

I am a Buckeye fan first and foremost, but it truly is a shame to see UC get snubbed like this. If fan attendance is really the issue, how can anyone justify taking Uconn over UC? Did Uconn even have a football team 5 years ago? I can't recall them having a reputation for football fans that travel well! UC beat two teams they got better bowl selections, and they gave WVU all they could handle. If it were my bowl, I'd want to put the best product on the field. Oh, and my bowl wouldn't be in Birmingham.

at 10:39 PM

Anonymous said...

So, Paul, are you telling UC fans to NOT go the bowl? You must really be an Ohio State fan after all.

You want to give more anti-UC fodder to our enemies? You want to make this a self-fullfilling prophecy?

We got jobbed. We know that. But UK fans go to the Music City Bowl, or the Motor City Bowl, or the Whatever Bowl. You support your team and your school.

Mike Waddell was not saying UC fans suck. He was saying that we all have to do our part. We're all part of a giant team, and each of us has a role to play. Coach is handing us our assignments, and we need to get the first down. Not a touchdown. We just need to keep moving the chains for this program and this school.

at 10:42 PM

Anonymous said...

Detroit, Toronto, Birmingham....yeah, things sure are getting better.

I'm sure Dantonio is regretting his decision, and something tells me BK won't mind the view of Clifton from his plush Ann Arbor office.

Same story, different coach.

Sucks.

at 12:20 AM

oldtimer said...

Whoa, padner. While I agree that blaming the fans for the Bowling for Dollars fiasco is over the top (why does Waddell get to hold himself blameless, he sounds like a jerk and powerless shell of an AD), still there are a lot of Johnny-come-lately's around the foootball team all of the sudden. These new "fans", where were they last year and the year before?

Sure, no one likes to support a struggling program,and UC has had its share of football woes. But those have been over for some time now, and seats have remained largely empty until this year. And don't look down your nose at some of the past bowl venues, getting invited to a lesser bowl has been icing on the cake in years gone by.

Yes, the whole city fell in love with this team this year, and rightfully so. Folks are still pinching themselves to see if it's real. You even said so. We got so close to a big time bowl we could smell it. It's a huge dissappointment. And a learning process. Now we know how the bowl jackals capture their prey.

But focus on the game for a minute, SoMiss has lost a legend of a coach this past week in an unmpopular firing, their players are all riled up and looking to send him out a winner, UC spurned CUSA, and people around here are acting like the game is a joke and already a sealed victory. Sounds like a situation ripe with upset, no? Keep talking trash, folks, and let's motivate SoMiss even more. If UC gets overconfident ( like the PItt game), and ends up losing, they take a big hit nationally and recruit-wise and look pretty foolish. Remember it's still national exposure and a big game. So Dock I agree with your observation that dumping on the fans is inappropriate, but looking down your nose at the actual game seems a little silly to me. It shapes up to be a pretty emotional contest.

at 1:10 AM

Anonymous said...

I can't find how to email you about your completely factless assault on a possible playoff system so here goes-

You are completely clueless. You give one reason why a playoff won't work (no one to fill the stadiums on short notice) and then justify the current system by making the same tired argument that the regular season is a playoff.

Lets take the second point first- the problem is the current BCS system rewards teams in mediocre conferences who play no one. An example? West Virgina. Who have they beaten? Western Michigan? Marshal? Maryland? You cite their win against Connecticut last week. Since when does the road to the National Championship go through Connecticut? That's the same team who was blown out by Cincinnati. Don't get me wrong, Cincinnati has had a good year, but any rational UC fan would agree they aren't among the elite teams in the country. Cincinnati couldn't even beat the hapless Louisville Cardinals at Nippert Stadium.

Consider what we are currently looking at for a National Championship game- two teams in very mediocre conferences that played NO ONE in their non-conference schedule. Do you really believe West Virginia is better than Georgia, Florida or USC?

As for your other point- that a playoff wouldn't allow for anyone to fill the stands- just how clueless have you gotten in your old age? Look at how Division II or III do it. Its not hard, Thomas Moore College has been in the playoffs on several occasions- that's a Division III school in Northern Kentucky by the way Paul. How did it work? Well, with a 16 team playoff, the first three rounds are played on the higher seeds home field. Do you really believe Ohio State would have trouble filling their stadium to play their first three games in a National Playoff? Or your beloved West Virgina? Or LSU? Please, think before you write Paul. When you are left with two final teams, don't you think they could fill up the Georgia Dome or the Rose Bowl or wherever for the National Championship? Me too.

A 16 team national championship tournament would ensure the best team in the country has a shot. The regular season wouldn't be meaningless, as home field advantage in the playoffs, as outlined above, would be simply HUGE. Furthermore, higher seeds would play lesser teams in the first couple of rounds. It would be the most exciting four weeks in College Sports, in my opinion, and rival anything that March Madness offers. It certainly would be better than the lame bowl season where we have mostly boring games than no one cares about outside of the teams playing. And it would ensure that the best team is not prevented from winning the national championship because two mediocre teams from mediocre conferences kept them out of the "national championship" game.

Get a clue Paul!

at 6:08 AM

WBW said...

I think I'll just stay in town and watch Huggi and the Bearcats...oh yeah I forgot, another brilliant UC decision....

at 6:32 AM

Anonymous said...

You guys live in freaking CINCINNATI, and you're ripping on Charlotte, Birmingham, Toronto, et al. These places may not be football Valhalla, but Cincinnati isn't exactly the center of the universe either. Grow up and stop whining. Geez. Your average little football team isn't going to a "glamorous" bowl game. Big deal. Then stay home and cry about it.

at 7:21 AM

Anonymous said...

The best thing to come out of the pizza.com bowl is that UC gets another 3 weeks of practice.

at 8:00 AM

Anonymous said...

Cincinnati is a sports town...Birmingham is not...You cannot compare them...Reds, Bengals, UC and XU basketball, and now UC football...Not to mention the huge amount of HS basketball and football that has dominated the state for years...Cincinnati has one of the most passionate sports fan bases in the country, so next time you want to compare Cincinnati to Birmingham, think again

at 8:49 AM

Anonymous said...

Below the belt, Paul...

at 10:00 AM

Frank Robinson's Ghost said...

Paul --

I often enjoy what you write, but you are a master at "cutting off your nose to spite your face." That's what you're suggesting here.

Yeah, UC fans! Stay home and don't go to bowl games, that'll show them! How dare they say you should travel? Sheesh. Paul -- following your advice will help ensure the Cats don't make a big bowl unless they are Top 5 in the country.

Remember -- if UC had beaten Pitt (Pitt for goshsakes!)instead of playing down to the level of our competition, we wouldn't be having this conversation.

It is too bad we didn't make a bigger bowl, and UC had a great, promising year, but the losses to Pitt and Lousiville showed we aren't there yet -- still need to grow up.

[I also have problems with BK repeatedly saying that being the most penalized team in the league doesn't bother him -- because his teams always get lots of penalties -- but that's another post.]

at 10:53 AM

Anonymous said...

If UC wants and needs us there so badly, they should offer to help get us there. How about providing free buses and a couple of tailgate parties? It seems like a worthwhile investment for the school to make.

If the future of the program depends on me spending money to go to Birmingham 3 days before Christmas to watch UC beat down a bad team, then too bad. It's not my problem.

at 11:09 AM

Anonymous said...

I'm often amazed at how sports teams expect to operate the exact opposite of every other business.

Imagine walking into a restaurant and the waiter says, "We have some great recipes, but unfortunately we cannot afford a good oven to prepare them. For now, we can sell you some slop that'll most likely make you ill. If you ever want some of our good food, it is necessary that you buy enough slop so that we can get that new oven."

Sports is the only industry where the consumer is told they are responsible for the initial investment.

at 11:23 AM

Paul Daugherty said...

I forgot the Humanitarian Bowl. Somehow.

at 11:41 AM

Anonymous said...

10:53 said, "It's not my problem."

That's right. It's not your problem, and it's not your team. Don't bother showing up at Nippert next year. With supporters like you...

at 11:51 AM

Anonymous said...

another scronny sportswriter popping off, who needs them

at 2:17 PM

Paul Daugherty said...

It's scrawny.

at 2:34 PM

Anonymous said...

listen, if the coach is able to get fan support to a high and is able to sell out ore than one game of the year, then he deserves to be shown respect. not to mention that this team that has been in the dumps for a while has come out with a national ranking and a bowl game. and for what? a journalist who has to tell their fans not to support this team. well thats pretty low in my opinion, especially if you claim to support UC.

at 2:41 PM

Osogato said...

I liked it better when you ignored the Bearcats. Why don't you try that again? I'll take my info from Josh and Lonnie at the Post, thanks.

(Word verificaton: upjor, as in, ujpor's Paul?)

at 6:30 PM

Anonymous said...

All I have heard the past two days regarding UC being snubbed is that we "owe it to the players and coaches" to attend these games. The only people that should attend the games for that reason are the friends and families of the players and coaches. Everyone else? Would a UC football player or coach would go out of their way, 700 miles X 2, to support you? No way (nothing personal). There are way too many fans and not enough coaches/players.

So, the question you need to ask yourself is "Why go to Birmingham?" Go for yourself. Have fun with your friends, cheer on your alma mater, watch a good football game (maybe), etc. We don't owe the players or the Bowl committees our attendance just so that we can get a better bowl bid next year. If we do that, we're doing exactly what they want us fans to do, spend more money.

at 12:51 AM

Anonymous said...

I definitely see the point you're making here. It is ridiculous at this point to put blame on fans for U.C. not getting a better bowl bid. The fan base is continuing to grow and I'm sure you'll see the proof in season ticket sales next season. For the first time in my life I attended every U.C. home game this year and it appears that many others will do the same next year.

I see UK football mentioned here a couple of times. How many of you loyal UK fans would have traveled to Toronto in the dead of winter to see your team play in a third rate bowl game? Get real.

It is ludacris to base what kind of bowl U.C. gets on how well the team has traveled to these games in the past. That was Conference USA and U.C. football was an afterthought...times have changed.

The bottom line is that U.C. football has finished the season RANKED, will likely go 10-3 for the first time since the 50's and the future is looking very bright for the program.

The Big East should be in a nice position to get more premier bowl bids in the future and all of this talk will be long forgotten.

Let us also not forget that if U.C. takes care of business in Pittsburgh earlier this year, this entire conversation never occurs.

Go Bearcats. Pound those Eagles.

at 1:30 AM

Anonymous said...

Hey 1:10 AM Watch the Sugar Bowl from 2 Years ago: West Va vs UGa.
Slaton and White were freshmen: watch them dominate my beloved Dawgs in the GA DOME, of all places.

Mountaineers are for real, and deserev berth in title game vs. Mizzou or OSU.
Georgia Dawgs will wind up in BCS title game next year behind Stafford, Knowshon, and young offensive line that continues to get better !!

Cincy Dog

at 2:01 AM

cats13 said...

Why is UC's bad bowl bid a fault of the fans? I am a student and loyal Bearcat and are one of many that have supported the team throughout the year. What else could we have done? Three sell out crowds isn't enough? Camping out for tickets either? Please let me know, all I want is our team to succeed.

at 8:34 AM

Anonymous said...

Wow. Let me straighten this whole thing out.

Waddell did NOT blame the fans. A hyper-sensitive few twisted his words to say as much, posted their whinings on the web, and so now we're all arguing against something the guy didn't even say, let alone mean.

He was giving information to the fans about what these bowl committees look for, and encouraging people to support the Cats in Birmingham (which, by the way, is what UC pays him to do) so in the future this won't be an issue for UC. That's it. He never said it was our fault. But he is showing us what we need to do for the future. One casts blame, the other shows direction.

So let's stop arguing against a straw man here. NO ONE BLAMED THE FANS.

at 8:37 AM

Anonymous said...

No offense, UC fans. But the Bearcats are a three-loss team, from a second-tier conference, without much tradition football-wise to speak of. The papajohns.com bowl sounds about right for UC this year.

That said - if they hammer Southern Miss and come back next year and win 10 or 11 games, including a win over West Virginia, then go back to the papajohns.com bowl, you've got a point...next year...

at 8:59 AM

Anonymous said...

Hey Barry Larkin!
Nothing against Lonnie or Josh but what are you going to do come Jan 1 when there is no Post?

Robert Young
Milford

at 12:33 PM

Anonymous said...

Paul,

I'm a UC alumni, fan, season ticket holder (who, by the way, can't go to the Papa John's Bowl two days before Christmas. I agree with you totally that some of these bowls are just useless. That said, if UC goes and wins and continues to win, I would hope that somewhere, somehow, we would begin to get the respect that I believe the program deserves.

I live in Troy up north of Dayton and, believe me, UC sports are treated like they don't even exist. The Troy paper, once in a while, puts in our scores but the only time we get press in the Dayton Daily News is when we lose. It seems that the writers in Dayton have some sort of grudge against the Cats. Maybe it's the fact that our basketball team beat UD something like 40 straight years before the Flyers finally won or the fact that we just aren't Ohio State. I really don't know but I DO know that there are many many UC graduates living in the area.

Finally, I WOULD have been able to go to the Sun Bowl in beautiful El Paso or even the Muffler Bowl in Charlotte. If only...

at 7:36 PM

Anonymous said...

Paul: You are so seldom right but in this case you've hit the name on the head. The bad bowl game UC is stuck with is not the fault of the fans as Waddell suggests. The problem is Thomas and Waddell. It was their job sell the football team to those bowl committees and it wasn't like they had nothing to sell. Those two didn't get the job done and then had the audacity to blame it on us.

at 9:09 PM

Anonymous said...

Paul:

You are very seldom right but you are in this case. Waddell's suggestion that it is the fans fault that UC is going to a low rent bowl is for the birds. The fault lies with Thomas and Waddell. It was their job to sell the UC football team to the bowl committees and they didn't get the job done. And, it isn't like they didn't have a really good product to sell.

at 11:04 PM

Anonymous said...

I said this on a previous post on another thread and I'll say it again here: UC has no room to complain about this bowl selection. We couldn't take care of business against Louisville (our homecoming!) and Pitt, two teams that UConn and USF beat. USF also beat WVA, who will in all likelihood be playing for the National Championship. At best, we can argue that our tiebreak against USF in the standings makes us technically third in the conference and therefore deserving of the #3 Big East tie-in Bowl, if only it worked that way in reality.

at 11:07 PM

Anonymous said...

Like your comments Paul even if some of the bloggers fail to decipher your point.10:53 hit it on the nose and some others.Although fan histories at the lower tier bowls play a part in some of these decisions, it's more politics than anything else.If UC KEEPS HANGING AROUND THE ELITE THEIR DAY WILL COME AND THE FANS WILL BE THERE.

at 9:03 PM

Anonymous said...

Looks like I overrated WVa on previous post. OSU vs. LSU is dream matchup: hope Buckeyes give up less than 41 and score more than 14. At least Boeckmann has better supporting cast than Brady Quinn did in his Superdome struggle against LSU.
Hey, Pitt is underrated: they beat Cincinnati and WVU. Too bad Pitt is in same boat as Alabama, watching bowls games on TV, sub-par records, heralded ex- Miami Dolphin coaches at the helm.

Cincy Dog

at 10:44 PM

Anonymous said...

I see why the Reds havn't done so well lately- no one on the steroids report list. They compete against all these guys who use steroids.

Previous Posts

Wednesday, November 28, 2007

Fans take it in the neck, again

37 Comments: